Author Topic: Poetic This!  (Read 103919 times)

Offline 510bhan

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #60 on: March 19, 2014, 05:39:20 PM »
Damn it! I was hoping you were going to revel some secret. Here's to hoping someone else will give up their mojo. :)

Like I've admitted before  . . . I'm really a prose writer who abuses the comforts of RMP to bounce ideas, find a way to create a more succinct image or to clear my head of 'stuff' which isn't appropriate for my novel but insists on bugging me and demands an outlet. ::)

Offline bri h

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #61 on: March 19, 2014, 05:42:02 PM »
Billy Connolly said something similar.

Quote

" I don't know where the comedy comes from. I'm just happy to be here when it shows up."

unquote.

It's the same with the poetry, I feel. Bri.
Fare thee well Skip. We're all 'Keening' now. xbx

Offline heidi52

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #62 on: March 19, 2014, 06:01:14 PM »
I get an idea of something and think of how I want to say it. Then I just play with words, letting them play, with my tongue or with each other or sometimes with themselves.  :o

Often they suggest others who want to join the party. My job is like a bouncer at an exclusive club. I let the right ones in. Or at least I try.

Offline CorneliusPoe

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Re: Poetic This! (a request)
« Reply #63 on: March 23, 2014, 01:06:16 PM »
I'd love to see this thread become its own topic under Poet Corner. It would allow us a fuller realization of Heidi's idea for the thread and still avoid infringement on the review threads. I can imagine threads for favorite poems. Approaches to writing, etc. Similar to what we have for general writing but tailored to poetry. Just a thought.
"Poetry is not speech raised to the level of music, but music brought down to the level of speech." - Paul Valery

Offline Tom 10

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #64 on: March 23, 2014, 05:30:53 PM »
Where do your poems come from?

Bri raised a question in one of the review threads that got me thinking. I had a recent family event and he ask if it sparked anything "poetic". Sadly It didn't, at least not yet. I'm wondering how others come to their poems. Do they spring to your mind whole or close to it? Do you plan them and set about work? I imagine each one is different.

Most of mine start with a line. I get it almost for free. I then set about trying to give it a home. Not a very poetic approach. I will say the end result sometimes leaves the original line off altogether. I also notice that these come mostly in the early AM when sleep is a little closer than rising.
 I recognize the nail soup method.  I use it frequently, and with me as well, the nail almost always needs to come out before the soup is ready.  I think the crucial step is to initially get every thought onto paper (screen) without any interference from my inner censor.  Follow any whiff of thought, connection, leap.  I need to get down as much as I can from the first train of thought and its distributaries.  After that I can look at the notes for what may be worth pursuing poetically, and that's usually from whence a draft appears.  I have adopted Robert Frost's practice of calling what doesn't successfully become a poem a writing exercise. :)  

Offline CorneliusPoe

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #65 on: March 23, 2014, 05:42:49 PM »
T.,

I was not familiar with the nail soup method till I read you comments and looked it up. Thanks.

Does anyone use mind mapping, either software or on paper? I recently started using a program called Scapple on the Mac for a larger project and am finding it remarkably helpful on a couple of longer poems. Just curious. Thanks.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2014, 05:47:36 PM by CorneliusPoe »
"Poetry is not speech raised to the level of music, but music brought down to the level of speech." - Paul Valery

Offline heidi52

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Re: Poetic This! (a request)
« Reply #66 on: March 24, 2014, 05:38:50 AM »
I'd love to see this thread become its own topic under Poet Corner. It would allow us a fuller realization of Heidi's idea for the thread and still avoid infringement on the review threads. I can imagine threads for favorite poems. Approaches to writing, etc. Similar to what we have for general writing but tailored to poetry. Just a thought.

I second that, if only because if you have something to post sometimes this thread is so far down on the list that you have to hunt for it. Would be nice if we could at least get it stickied so it remains on top.  Maybe a kindly mod will take pity on us . . .

Nail soup, eh? In my grandmother's version it was made with a stone. Same concept but we were so poor we couldn't afford a nail.  :D

Offline Amie

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Re: Poetic This! (a request)
« Reply #67 on: March 24, 2014, 01:27:29 PM »
I second that, if only because if you have something to post sometimes this thread is so far down on the list that you have to hunt for it. Would be nice if we could at least get it stickied so it remains on top.  Maybe a kindly mod will take pity on us . . .

Nick isn't keen on having lots of stickies, as it reduces space on the front page for reviews.

You could bookmark the thread, so you don't have to go searching on the second page for it.
"You do not need to leave your room. Remain sitting at your table and listen. Do not even listen, simply wait, be quiet still and solitary. The world will freely offer itself to you to be unmasked, it has no choice, it will roll in ecstasy at your feet." - Kafka

Offline Tom 10

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #68 on: April 12, 2014, 12:22:35 PM »
Hi,

Neghe had a tremendous post: http://mywriterscircle.com/index.php?topic=52951.0
and there were some great responses.

I'm responding on this thread because I support this thread as the place for general poetry talks.

I am moved by Neghe's most excellent plea for the heart of poetry.  I can only read this as a statement of the goal of writing poetry, the exhortation to aim higher, dig deeper, write better.   Sadly, and with all due respect, I canít accept any part of this as the definition of poetry.   And I agree that its absurd to try to pin it down.  I used to love to fashion definitions for all sorts of things, especially things like poetry.  It felt intellectual.  It made me feel smart and accomplished.  The problem, I found, was not so much how to fervently describe what I wanted to include, or to identify what by all rights needs to be included.  In retrospect I have come to believe that much of what constitutes great poetry is self-selecting, and for that no definition or criteria is demanded, merely lucid descriptions of what elbows its way into the blessed circle.  The problem with a definition of poetry, is the corresponding obligation to a willingness to declare what is not poetry.   I have little difficultly (conceptually) developing criteria and definitions and whatnot to identify ineffective writing.  But I balk at feeling either a need or a competency to distinguishing between poetry and non-poetry.  I shudder at the notion of holding up my self-devised (or self-approved) definitions to good writing and declaring this is not poetry.  Every notion Iíve ever held about what, definitively, is poetry, has fallen.  I expect that to continue to happen.  So, it seems this is no more than my appeal for bad poetry or at least modest poetry.  If poetry must be the purest, deepest, most blinding razorís edge, then 99% of what we call poetry is in fact not.  99% of the folks we consider poets are in fact not.  And the 1% are the 1% perhaps only 1% of the time.  Iím not going to the mountain top with a megaphone for that, no way in hell. :)

There is the poem to put in our ears the ground-shaking roar of the lift-off of the Saturn V from Cape Kennedy sending Apollo 11 to the moon and forty-five years of reverberating history.  That would definitely be a poem, and while I would love to write it, I sincerely doubt it.  But that is not the only poetry.   I will also call poetry the sharing of the anxiety of a sub-contract designer of a trip-relay series installed on the command module who he sits at home with the head of his golden lab on his lap as both watch the launch on TV, and eat day old Cheetos.  And I will not exclude a brief description of the way the grass clippings clung to the dried watermelon-sticky between my fingers and the way the well water from the hose got colder that July afternoon when my now-deceased mother glistened with pride and awe as she described to me what she had just learned.  Or the time years later driving back from South Dakota, everyone else asleep, but me and my four year old, us talking about the moon landing.  A poem does not need to be WWIII or Jesus bleeding on the Cross or the moment of true enlightenment.  A poem can be a quiet talk between author and reader on the bank of some small creek winding nowhere, and meaning little.  If its shitty writing thatís one thing.  It does nobody a service to say whatís not a poem, though.  All just my ramblings.  Feel free to skip this if you want. 8)

Offline Mark T

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #69 on: April 12, 2014, 12:45:07 PM »

Tom, this is a good poem. Thanks for posting.

Hi,

Neghe had a tremendous post: http://mywriterscircle.com/index.php?topic=52951.0
and there were some great responses.

I'm responding on this thread because I support this thread as the place for general poetry talks.

I am moved by Neghe's most excellent plea for the heart of poetry.  I can only read this as a statement of the goal of writing poetry, the exhortation to aim higher, dig deeper, write better.   Sadly, and with all due respect, I canít accept any part of this as the definition of poetry.   And I agree that its absurd to try to pin it down.  I used to love to fashion definitions for all sorts of things, especially things like poetry.  It felt intellectual.  It made me feel smart and accomplished.  The problem, I found, was not so much how to fervently describe what I wanted to include, or to identify what by all rights needs to be included.  In retrospect I have come to believe that much of what constitutes great poetry is self-selecting, and for that no definition or criteria is demanded, merely lucid descriptions of what elbows its way into the blessed circle.  The problem with a definition of poetry, is the corresponding obligation to a willingness to declare what is not poetry.   I have little difficultly (conceptually) developing criteria and definitions and whatnot to identify ineffective writing.  But I balk at feeling either a need or a competency to distinguishing between poetry and non-poetry.  I shudder at the notion of holding up my self-devised (or self-approved) definitions to good writing and declaring this is not poetry.  Every notion Iíve ever held about what, definitively, is poetry, has fallen.  I expect that to continue to happen.  So, it seems this is no more than my appeal for bad poetry or at least modest poetry.  If poetry must be the purest, deepest, most blinding razorís edge, then 99% of what we call poetry is in fact not.  99% of the folks we consider poets are in fact not.  And the 1% are the 1% perhaps only 1% of the time.  Iím not going to the mountain top with a megaphone for that, no way in hell. :)

There is the poem to put in our ears the ground-shaking roar of the lift-off of the Saturn V from Cape Kennedy sending Apollo 11 to the moon and forty-five years of reverberating history.  That would definitely be a poem, and while I would love to write it, I sincerely doubt it.  But that is not the only poetry.   I will also call poetry the sharing of the anxiety of a sub-contract designer of a trip-relay series installed on the command module who he sits at home with the head of his golden lab on his lap as both watch the launch on TV, and eat day old Cheetos.  And I will not exclude a brief description of the way the grass clippings clung to the dried watermelon-sticky between my fingers and the way the well water from the hose got colder that July afternoon when my now-deceased mother glistened with pride and awe as she described to me what she had just learned.  Or the time years later driving back from South Dakota, everyone else asleep, but me and my four year old, us talking about the moon landing.  A poem does not need to be WWIII or Jesus bleeding on the Cross or the moment of true enlightenment.  A poem can be a quiet talk between author and reader on the bank of some small creek winding nowhere, and meaning little.  If its shitty writing thatís one thing.  It does nobody a service to say whatís not a poem, though.  All just my ramblings.  Feel free to skip this if you want. 8)

Offline Tom 10

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #70 on: April 12, 2014, 12:55:13 PM »
Tom, this is a good poem. Thanks for posting.


Mark, I get the irony of your statement. 8)
I just hope its not shitty writing.

T

Offline CorneliusPoe

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #71 on: April 12, 2014, 01:21:24 PM »
Quote
The problem with a definition of poetry, is the corresponding obligation to a willingness to declare what is not poetry.

T. Your entire response is excellent. The line above belongs in text books.

Thanks to Neghe, again for raising the topic.

With all due respect I think a single thread is insufficient to the task of in depth poetry discussion. A separate board on the same level as the other two would be much better and preserve the desire to keep the daily poems for review up at the top.
"Poetry is not speech raised to the level of music, but music brought down to the level of speech." - Paul Valery

Offline heidi52

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #72 on: April 12, 2014, 02:26:09 PM »
Excellent response Tom. When I read Neghe's original post I too thought it belonged here.

This thread in it's present form is the best we've got. It's been explained many times that it's not how the forum is structured and they don't want to make an exception.. Their ball, their rules. We can live with that. If you see a general discussion item, redirect it here. It will ensure it comes to the top frequently  :D

Offline Neghe

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #73 on: April 12, 2014, 11:15:27 PM »
 And the 1% are the 1% perhaps only 1% of the time.  Iím not going to the mountain top with a megaphone for that, no way in hell. :)

..."and the crux of the biscuit is the apostrophe." --Frank Zappa.
ďPoetry is what happens when nothing else can.Ē― Charles Bukowski

Offline Neghe

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Re: Poetic This!
« Reply #74 on: April 12, 2014, 11:22:35 PM »
Excellent response Tom. When I read Neghe's original post I too thought it belonged here.

This thread in it's present form is the best we've got. It's been explained many times that it's not how the forum is structured and they don't want to make an exception.. Their ball, their rules. We can live with that. If you see a general discussion item, redirect it here. It will ensure it comes to the top frequently  :D

My thread is in it's own place because it is a poem. And has a direction of its own: which will become clear as it goes along. People can discuss certain aspects of it as they see fit however, it is an on-going item. So, it would be nice if people would refrain from trying to force everything into the same box.

Respectfully, Nee.
 
ďPoetry is what happens when nothing else can.Ē― Charles Bukowski