Author Topic: Help with grammar question, please  (Read 2110 times)

Nelodra

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Help with grammar question, please
« on: September 03, 2006, 06:27:40 PM »
I've got this sentence that I'm just not sure about whether or not I've got it right.

is it:
"A roguish smile spread over his face, as he remembered all the pranks he and Darol had played upon innocent, unsuspecting peasants when they were still boys."

or should it be:
"A roguish smile spread over his face, as he remembered all the pranks him and Darol had played upon innocent, unsuspecting peasants when they were still boys."

What's the rule?

Offline Jillanne Nehls

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Re: Help with grammar question, please
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2006, 09:43:20 PM »
Hi Nadine,

There is a little trick that will tell you which is right. Take out "and Darol" and see whether he or him will work. That's the one you use.

"A roguish smile spread over his face, as he remembered all the pranks he and Darol had played upon innocent, unsuspecting peasants when they were still boys."

""A roguish smile spread over his face, as he remembered all the pranks him and Darol had played upon innocent, unsuspecting peasants when they were still boys."


You wouldn't say, "...all the pranks him had played upon innocent, unsuspecting...." 

You would say, "...all the pranks HE had played upon innocent, unsuspecting...."

Is this clear? I hope so!

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Nelodra

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Re: Help with grammar question, please
« Reply #2 on: September 04, 2006, 04:25:12 AM »
Thanks, Jilanne.
That's great trick  :)
I'll try to remember it; actually I think I'd better jot it down somewhere...

Nadine L

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Re: Help with grammar question, please
« Reply #3 on: September 04, 2006, 04:30:50 AM »
Nelodra,

Try this:  ...Doral and he...  Unless it is part of his speech pattern to be a bit rustic, therefore, he would think in those terms as well.

He is a subject pronoun/personal pronoun.  Him is an object pronoun.

The whole problem is that you've read it a couple of times and it just gets maddening!  Geeze, it is starting to confuse me!   :o

Jillanne's trick is the one I use, too.

This may or may not help http://www.eslus.com/LESSONS/GRAMMAR/POS/pos6.htm

Nadine

Nelodra

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Re: Help with grammar question, please
« Reply #4 on: September 04, 2006, 04:43:12 AM »
Wow, Nadine, that site looks like the lessons I always failed to understand in school.  :-[
The funny thing is, although I'm really bad at grammar, I usually write perfect sentences in my own language, going just by "instinct". I also know when I can and cannot write "incorrect" sentences in my own language.
In English it's a little more difficult of course, since that's on ly my sencond language, although even in English I usually get everything right just going by instinct.
It's just a few little things like the one I mentioned here that get me confused - and indeed: the confusion comes from having heard - or even read - these kind of things being said the wrong way just one time too many.
I'll stick to Jilanne trick for this one; Simple tricks usually work better for me than difficult rules  ;)

Oh, yes, and Darol's speech pattern isn't exaclty lofty; he's just a simple shepherd. But to behonest, I didn't even think of thatwhen I wrote that sentence, this just felt like the way he would say it. His beloved - and imperial princess - would obviously have said the same thing very differently. Not that she ever got the chance to do the same thing...  ;D

Nadine L

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Re: Help with grammar question, please
« Reply #5 on: September 04, 2006, 04:52:24 AM »
Nelordra,

I don't mind grammar rules, but geeze, do we have to have so many exceptions? 

Seriously, I just drop the "and xxx" to make it easier to figure out.  I was looking for a chart of pronouns to make sure I was still thinking straight and googled "subject pronoun".  The link was the first on the list.

Yes, your character would say it in the order you wrote it.  Good instincts!

What's your first language?

Nadine

Nelodra

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Re: Help with grammar question, please
« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2006, 05:38:07 AM »
My first language is Dutch, which I've been told is a difficult language.  ;)
Well... I guess that only counts for foreigners.