Author Topic: can no one help zimbabwe?  (Read 1444 times)

Offline jeanette

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can no one help zimbabwe?
« on: June 22, 2008, 05:56:59 PM »
Morgan Tsvangirai has now stood down as opponent to Mugabe in Zimbabwe. The reason for this is that his supporters have been thrashed, tortured, their families terrorised, and he himself has been beaten. He says he believes that there will never be democracy in his country while Mugabe is in power. The sad thing is, now he has
gone, there is no viable alternative.

I have just watched this on the news with a desperate sinking heart. Can no one save Zimbabwe?
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Offline ellie

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Re: can no one help zimbabwe?
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2008, 06:06:43 PM »
Yes it is terrible sad Jeanette and my heart goes out to the people of Zimbabwe. It seems the world and specially those neighbouring countries like South Africa are prepared to stand by and watch whilst the people there are either beaten,tortured, killed or starved to death...
and whats the matter with the United nations? They are like toothless bulldogs.
I watched the politics show this morning and a radio station has been set up by Zimbabweans in England (there are half million living here) and they have some contact with the people there. One man managed to get through to say he had been badly beaten and also whipped...he also said that Mugabe had ordered all satellite dishes to be taken down so there is no contact with the outside world.
The people in the radio station were sending money to their families,including some white people, but someone said that is virtually useless as there is no food in the shops.

Satan is at large in the world and he has plenty of disciples..Mugabe amongst them.

God help those poor people..as it seems noone else is going to!
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Offline ellie

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Re: can no one help zimbabwe?
« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2008, 12:38:07 PM »
I am truly astonished that noone has anything to say on this subject ???
The cure for boredom is curiosity.There is no cure for curiosity
Oscar Wilde
http://www.goldstarbooks.co.uk/ellie_Bowdery.htm

StrayDog

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Re: can no one help zimbabwe?
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2008, 12:43:15 PM »
Quote
I am truly astonished that noone has anything to say on this subject
What else is there to say?

An evil man and his followers are committing atrocities. The rest of the world is doing nothing to stop him.

Offline Gyppo

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Re: can no one help zimbabwe?
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2008, 02:50:30 PM »
Ellie, I suspect many of us have very strong feelings about this but see no advantage to the people of Zimbabwe in us airing them on this circle.

People like Mugabe play by an entirely different rule book.  How can we, as a resonably civilised people, even begin to understand how he even came to power yet alone how he hangs on.  The politics of brute force are something we, as a nation, prefer not to understand.  Despite having been very good at it ourselves in the days of the British Empire.  We have, perhaps, moved on.  Others remember how it worked and apply it on a slightly smaller scale. 

Mugabe is a mad dog who should have been put down years ago, but he wasn't.  Mad dogs surround themselves with pack followers who may be terrified of the pack leader (Idi Amin was another such pack leader) but they depend on him for mutual protection from the vast body of outsiders who aren't part of the pack.

The outsiders are generally a much bigger pack and could probably overthrow the ruling pack just by sheer numbers alone, but it rarely happens because very few people want to be the first to die, and individual heroes are easily picked off.

Mugabe has another advantage shared by few other dictators.  It may not seem like an advantage, but psychologically it is.  He's Old.  He's well past his biblical 'three score and ten' and could drop dead from natural causes at any time.  Once he does his pack will probably turn on each other in a mad scramble for power, and in the confusion sanity may prevail and deals will be struck with other nations in return for recognition, supplies, etc..

In the meantime there is always the sustaining thought that 'this too will pass', that the mad dog will die without anyone risking their life to challenge him.  The people have endured his rule for this long and it can't last forever.  If they keep their heads down for a while longer change will inevitably happen.  If they rise in revolt many of them will inevitably die.  In this context - totally incomprehensible to we who live in democrarcies and even semi-democracies - going along with the staus quo is a well learned, almost conditioned, survival skill.

It's a pretty safe bet that no politician of any party will risk his career by doing anything other than 'talk tough'.  Why?  Because if any country decided to intervene - using the necessary force - politicians in other countries would be quick to condemn it as 'interference in the affairs of a sovereign state'.  The ongoing mess which ensued when Saddam Hussein was toppled is an all too present reminder to politicians of what happens when 'outsiders' alter the balance of power.

As a Buddhist would say, "Change needs to come from within."  Zimbabwe is a nation in waiting.  Once the pack leader dies change will be inevitable.  Probably bloody as well as the various tribes jockey for position and power, because in African counties there is also the added political dimension of various tribal loyalties and conflicts, something which doesn't play a major part in British politics - yet.

***

See, I've expressed my opinion and feel a little better for it, but as long as the mad dog continues to rule the balance of power stays as it is, and politicians - despite all their tough talk, and clamouring for change whenever we have an election - usually prefer stability and continuity, however unpleasant the face it wears.  Which is why some English politicians voted to appease Hitler,  and why many Americans back then hoped for a seperate 'negotiated peace' before they realised the truly insatiable appetite of the man.

Gyppo
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Offline jeanette

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Re: can no one help zimbabwe?
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2008, 06:15:22 PM »
I agree, Gyppo, but Mugabe started out as a freedom fighter, a liberator. He fought white rule and won, just as the ANC did in South Africa. As a result, the South African president Mbeki, who was a young man when these struggles were going on, admires Mugabe, despite his systematic destruction of Zimbabwe's economy. This is why Mbeki will not stand against him now, and can only issue lily livered hopes of ‘talks leading to a resolution’.

However, Mbeki's undoubted successor Zuma, who is already leader of the ANC, is openly critical of Mugabe, surprisingly so. South Africa has the power to bring the Zimbabwean government to its knees, so there is hope, albeit on the far horizon.  No comfort for the poor Zimbabweans of today, I know.

I do still wonder, however, if the west has no right to interfere in African politics, what gives it the right to interfere in Middle Eastern politics? But that’s another story…
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Offline ellie

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Re: can no one help zimbabwe?
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2008, 11:45:04 AM »
well at least I got some response ;D

I have a great interest in Zimbabwe as quite a lot of my family lived there...in fact my late cousin (20 years older than me), married the niece of a former primeminister (Garfield Todd)..but Todd was 'too liberal' and wanted the black people to rule themselves and he was soon ousted from power.
Todd came to the then Southern Rhodesia from New Zealand and opened a missionary school there..Im not absolutely sure but I believe Robert Mugabe was a former student there..
From what Ive read, Todd was pleased when Mugabe was voted president and placed great hopes in him but after a while he saw the way he was heading.

As I say, my Mum's brother's family lived there, when it was a thriving and beautiful country..think it was known as the garden of Africa.
My late cousin fought in the civil war (he lived there over 40 years until his death) and adopted the daughter of a friend who died during that war.
Mugabe was seen as a hero to his people then.
I know there wasn't equality for the blacks in those days but at least they had jobs, food, housing (I argued many a time with my late cousin over treatment of the blacks but he said I didn't understand the 'tribal' system there)
My cousin had a huge house with many working for him and a man Joseph,who ran the household,  was still with him up till he died (my cousin was killed on a level crossing crash) and considered one of the family.
No doubt that Mugabe has become a despot, meglamaniac...anything to cling onto power and at the same time destroying a once thriving beautiful country and more important of all, his own people.
Evil incarnate.

and before anyone says about Iraq & our part in it, I was dead against it & left the Labour party over it...
1000s died & dying and for what?

as I said in a former post, Satan is alive and well and has many disciples..I almost feel that the book of Revelations is upon us and that things are set to get worse.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2008, 11:47:39 AM by ellie »
The cure for boredom is curiosity.There is no cure for curiosity
Oscar Wilde
http://www.goldstarbooks.co.uk/ellie_Bowdery.htm

Offline Xerika

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Re: can no one help zimbabwe?
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2008, 08:18:07 PM »
I have no idea if petitions make any difference, but for the sake of a couple of mouse clicks and a few key presses...

http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_zimbabwe/6.php?cl=100989988

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/196731055?z00m=15556340
http://rob-johnson.org.uk/ - writing, podcasting and reluctant olive farming

"I'd Rather Eat My Own Face" podcast. The truth about olive harvesting. http://wp.me/p2bC2C-8U

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